Topic: Practicing for competition... methods?

[kayko2000]

Here's one thing I've observed over the last year: during competition, my 3-bar often fails me.
And this is terrible because I play forward in doubles.

As far as local standards, my opponents respect my offense.  I use both pull shot and push-kick and during practice and weekly fun nights, they stand up.

But as soon as our bigger tournaments come around, and I'm playing against guys who I should beat but that aren't too far behind me, my 3-bar just doesn't perform.  I can still put up Top 5 placing (5th, 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, and 5th in my last 5 singles tournaments; 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 5th in the last 4 doubles), but it's almost never because of a dominating 3-bar.  Usually it's from decent defense and capitalizing on fast opportunities.  I find myself scoring in from the back 2-bar and 5-bar more than the 3 - even if my 5-to-3 passing is doing okay.  Or if I do score form the 3, it's often because I'm doing little chips, little dinks, etc.  Obviously, I think it's ridiculous and it needs to change.

Clearly, nerves is a part of this.  My pullshot often misfires and goes wide.  My timing on the push-kick is way off and usually I can't even hit the ball.

Any suggestions on how to:

1. Practice to accommodate "tournament emotions"?  In another older post, Loffredo had said "When I practice my pullshot for the worlds.. I practice with a tight grip because I know when I get under pressure that my grip will get tight just from the stress of getting amped up or nervous."  Something like that?

2. How to calm my nerves and get my timing and "feeling" back in tournaments.

Thanks!

[foozkillah]

K,

That's very common for a lot of players.  I'd recommend practicing your pullshots and pushkicks in the hundreds if you can.  Experiment with different grips and placements of the ball (directly under the bar, further back, or even in front (as many long pullkicks set this way to maximize the lateral spin at the pitch, or takeoff).

One thing you have to realize is how important practice is, even after you've figured out your most correct technique for doing the shot.  Do you hit the ball basically in the same area where you initially pulled or pushed it?  Concentrating your technique on rolling the ball that 1/3 or 1/4 turn so that you virtually hit it where you were initially touching it at the takeoff locks your mind on the technique.  Doesn't matter if you come off the ball, stay on it, or "micro-ride" it on the way to the release point.  Doesn't matter if you can only do this slowly.  More practice to start smoothly so you don't slip at the takeoff, and repetition (dozens and dozens) to develop lateral speed with acceleration prevents you from getting "tell" or hitch to signal the defender.

I teach this to noobs so that they can concentrate on the feel of the pull, push, and kicks.  Do this enough times and you will be able to BRING YOUR MIND BACK TO THE TECHNIQUE, ignoring what the defender's doing.  Who cares about putting the ball into the right hole when you're not even leaving the house properly, flubbing takeoffs?  Practice the shot like a mantra, which the more you do the more you can discipline your mind to ignore outside stimuli and just do the shot.  I know, it takes major kahunas sometimes to detach yourself at front in a tense, tight game, but centuries of humans talking and writing about staying cool in a tough situation isn't based on bad observation.  Detaching yourself allows you to remember how your fingers, hand, palm, wrist and arm feels when you shoot.  You're there when you can remember specific shots in a mental "slo-mo" replay version.

Another tip I give to noobs and even intermediate rooks is not to get too physically VISUAL.  Many players are initially attracted to the immediate eye-hand-coordination nature of foosball, specifically the feedback from execution, which releases certain endorphins for most humans.  However, this is not the famed "ZONE", where one seems unconscious of extraneous sounds, voices, movement and general surroundings.  Many foosers accordingly can create a sort of self-hypnosis where they are really following the ball and all the movements, kneejerk reacting and FLAILING at times as the game gets tougher.  This is not good.  You must realize when you shoot a pull or other under-the-rod shot, or even pinned shots too, that the ball is pretty much occluded (slightly under the player's foot) right at the release point, unless you have some weird stance where your head is almost to the table surface.  HINT.

The only way you can confidently hit and release the ball from a pull or push is YOU HAVE TO VISUALIZE the ball under the foot, and correctly gauge how it's rolling or spinning while partly hidden from view.  This is what gets most "nervous Nellies" who spaz out in a match at the 3bar.  Especially in a tight match for the money or at least the semis or finals, those who get into that almost self-hypnotic state BASICALLY BLANKS OUT MOMETARILY at that crucial stage.  How to get around it?  Practice till you pick or get a technique that works for that shot, and then PRACTICE BEYOND so that you can do it without looking..  I actually tell noobs to look away and do it by muscle memory.  No visual cues from the defenders, the surroundings or your own ball under your player's foot to blank out the process.

If you drive to work, then you'll know how at the beginning when you were unfamiliar, you originally prolly went carefully, watching everything around you the first few times.  Each time you got more and more familiar, however, and boiling down the route and even choices due to traffic conditions, until you have a pretty much set and smooth routine.  Then you keep driving and using that routine.  After months, you basically do the route unconsciously and very economically, because you know where the snags and the best routes are.  I'm sure you've been where you go into automatic and end up at work or at home.  In MINIMUM TIME but no real thought to it.  That's the REAL ZONE.

Going back to the shot ball analogy, you've prolly heard of baseball batters visually recognizing the spin and individual stitches on the pitched baseball, or basketball players see a basket 15-30 feet away but saying it seemed huge, and many other instances.  This is the REAL ZONE... you've basically recreated the motion and action of the ball and are able to see through anything in the way (kinda like those cutaways on Discovery or Science Channel et al) and can actually magnify it in your mind in any way you wish.  The "beyond" practice reinforces your mind's correct anticipation of where the ball and what position it's in at ANY TIME, and the practice routine prevents overcranking or relying on visual cues for timing.

Hope you get there Kayko.  And in a related topic, you should see what that normal but unwanted totally visual cueing does to you when you try to defend 5bar passing that way, falling prey in certain streaks or whole matches to an opposing forward you normally don't have major trouble blocking from passing.  It's like you put yourself on the other's string.

[kayko2000]

That's great.  Thanks foozkillah.
I'm going to read this article a few more times to really drive the point home.

Somewhat unrelated, I do a foosball eMagazine called "FoosLife" here in Taiwan.  We had our first issue at the start of June, next issue in July.  Can I pop your response into our magazine?  I think your responses are all generally well written and can be used directly.

If so, maybe I can get some other details from you:

Name
State, USA (I assume)

Maybe some of your playing experience info, and a headshot.  You can email me at tfa.pub-AT-gmail, or post here if you're okay with it.

For anyone else interested, here's what the Magazine looks like right now.  It's audience is mainly Taiwan foosers -- with some ex-pats in the mix.  So, we've got articles in both Chinese and English.
          http://www.foosball.tw/news/2009/newsletter/FoosLife/FoosLife-June.html

I'm always looking for articles that will help players on skill, strategy, or just to know what's going on in the foos world.  If anyone wants to contribute, we'd love to hear your stories.  Could be about anything foos-related.

I'll probably put up a different posting about that, but just thought I'd mention it here first.

Thanks!
Kayko

[foozkillah]

Sure,

You know my name from my previous PM's, although I'd prefer my "Foozkillah" name to be the "by author".  That also prevents any webspider placed anywhere between your host and my host from stripping my name and throwing into a a mash DB for spamming and other stuff.  And I play down here in South Florida with Fred G, formerly Fred from Vanci, then FredinShanghai, now FredinFtLauderdale, remember?  Also with Mark Winker, Mr. Netfoos himself.

Please use Foozkillah, from Palm Beach, FL, USA.  And I'm organizing the points for that essay about that same subject of too much visual cueing, but this time how it can ruin one's 5bar D, no matter how excited, quick to the snap, pumped up, or edgy you are.  And the recommendation to use the basic 50-50 D to resolve that.

[kayko2000]

Thanks!
Actually, if you don't mind, the 50-50 D is another article I'd love to put in in a future issue.
I'll also post the links to these original articles in the eMagazine.

Cheers...

[bbtuna]

i am glad you are asking killa for permission, it is respectful, but technically, this is a public forum and you don't have to get permission but as i said, I think it show respect and I think it shows class

you ought to read "mental attitude" thread...there is a lot of reading but it is really good stuff...it has and is helping me quite a bit

http://www.foosball.com/forum/index.php?topic=2485.0

I will sum up for me...I have to trust my body and not let my mind try and work itself through the mechanics of the shot...this is why when you play pick up games things go well when there is no stress and you are playing more on feel but as soon as your consious mind starts to try and deal with surrounding and situations and you try and work through your shot mechanics at the same time, it creates a mess

your consious mind gets in the way of what your body can do and it can not possibily get through all the needed detail in the time given...for me its like sorting through a large data bases looking for specific details and then trying to get them all lined up in the correct order and just when I think I have them right I start to think about some aspect of it more than I should then try and go back to the beginning of the chain and then realize I don't have all the details, or think I might not and so I go back to the data base and start the search again

some of you will probably really relate to this cycle...my consious mind fights for control and isn't going to be satisfied unless it can gather all the details, situation, mechanics, and strategy and control each one all at the same time...

however, I have believed for a many many years that the body is capable of so much if we simply let it do what it already knows how to do...recently I have been trying very hard to discipline myself to this and fighting my consious mind for who is in control...I love my consious mind but it needs to just step aside and allow my body to do- let it do all it has been taught and all that it can do even without teaching

when i do this, the results are amazing...the thread above will provide lots of detail for you and others to discover their own journey

all that aside, here are a couple practical things...
*  First, pick a pull or a pushkick, don't do both right now...I am not saying never, you may be the one person who can do both in competition but for now, just focus on one of them...
*  Focus on one so you can build confidence and because if you are like most people, it takes time to build the muscel memory need for a stroke...there are a ton of strokes needed just to be able to do a pull shot really well and to double that with another shot is asking too much
*  Also if you choose just one shot, you can begin to catalog the different defenses you face and decide what needs to be done to deal with one style and another...even if it means you get bricked someone times, use those times of loss to train you to deal with that kind of defense in the future...if you are trying to do this with two shots it is so much more work
* After selecting your main shot, start a serious approach to building the strokes needed to master it

below is a some of what the best pull shooter ever says about building a good pull...I add this for several reasons.  First, you need to see why trying to develop or maintain two different shots is near impossible.  Second, to give you some ideas on building up your shot in practice...

Todd Lofrredo 1996
After you get a decent stroke, experiment with different sets. Ball very far back, ball back fairly far, Ball back a little. Ball straight under the rod. Ball in front of the rod. Ball way in front of the rod. Teach yourself how to execute a straight-middle and long from those different sets. Now after you master this, then it's time to expand and add a dimension to your game. After all you've earned it!

So now we are going to shoot a pull shot with the ball straight under the rod and the man slightly under or in front of the ball so that the back half of the man is even with the center of the ball. Learn all three shots from this position. Straight-middle-Long. You will notice that the ball stubs easy from this position but that you can also hit tight tucking middles and that the straight is slower because you have further to travel. Actually this set is slower because you have further to travel. This is why Johnny Horton shot is a little slow but very accurate.

Now do the same ball position except with your man on the back side of the ball with the front of the man even with the middle of the ball, set for a pull. Learn how to hit the Straight-middle-long from this position.. After a few days of this you will understand it better. This is harder than being in front of the ball so bear with it until you understand it somewhat. Definitely not easy. You have to spray the ball more to get it to the hole but it is much faster because your almost behind the ball already.

Move the ball back behind the rod a little and try it again. This is preferred way to set the ball on my shot. Learn all three shots, Straight -middle - long. Now move the ball in front of the rod and put the man below the ball in your set so that the back part of the foot is even with the center of the ball, again more like Hortons set.

Congratulations!! you now have a multidimensional pull shot.. Ready to improve on it? Good..Lets add yet another Dimension to your pull. This part is about stance. Learn how to shoot your favorite stance, whatever it may be. Now after you figure out what your favorite is then try a few from the body position that you caught your wall pass in. Lane pass also. I learned early in my career to shoot a pull shot with my right foot forward. I use to hit the long very good from that position and practiced it. I learned that people would leave me easy longs before I got in my regular stance.

Look how Tracy Mac stands. His body hardly moves and yet his shot is beautiful and fast. I'll bet he could hit that same shot standing on one leg after a few attempts. So stance is more about comfort than anything. Just standing in front of the rods with your right leg slightly back is probably the norm. Tommy Atkinson can stand with his right foot pointing straight sideways and still hit a great long. He is not tall, he is practiced. So work on many stances and look at the results of the stance.

Then learn the body positions that you pass in. All the shots, Straight middle and long..After this you have become a multidimensional pull shot guru! But just when you think you have it all, you can yet learn another dimension. Shooting on the roll. The thing that can put fear into the strongest defenses. Why? because now they have to block you 100 percent of the time that you are rolling the ball over and that can be unnerving for a goalie and put major heat on the other forward. Learn all the shots on the roll from many of the pass stances also.

Also, learn a quick set.  But learning how to shoot from all the positions makes the set much easier because your sets don't have to be so perfect. Learn how to shoot from about a 1/4 to 1/2 inch from the perfect set also because you get many sets like this when time and nerves are a factor. Is your shot complete yet? Oh contraire Mon friar

Now learn how to shoot without moving your hand or shoulders and letting your body language give the signal that your about to shoot. . You've done it! You are now master of the pull shot Universe. What's next!?

[foozkillah]

Thanks!
Actually, if you don't mind, the 50-50 D is another article I'd love to put in in a future issue.
I'll also post the links to these original articles in the eMagazine.
Cheers...

Not at all..  You might add that I'm open to questions on it, which is what really clarifies its philosophy.   If they aren't on here, I'm sure you could pass those on, and I'll try my best to discuss those.

[kayko2000]

Thanks to everyone who replied.

bbtuna, about asking for permission, I just think it's the right thing to do.  I don't want anyone to feel like I'm ripping off ideas.  Give credit where credit is due.

I just booked a flight to Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia for the VIFA Asia Open next month.  My first big competition.
But I'll be honest... I'm not too concerned about how I play.  I just want to travel somewhere and play and enjoy myself while taking in the sights and sounds of the city.  I love travel just as much as foosball, so I won't be disappointed either way.

In some ways, I expect to be creamed.  Most of the Malaysian players are fairly good I've been told, and the UAE guys are even better.  I just hope to surprise a few people and hold up my side somewhat competitively.

Nevertheless, with the table at home, I'll be spending more time practicing.  Particularly my 5-bar and 5-to-3 passing.

[PatRyan]

You also might want to start playing differently.  By that, I mean it sounds like you are trying to WIN.  Winning is not an action, it is a result.  Winning is not something you do.  Try to play each possesion of the ball perfectly.  The things you have control over are the things you should concentrate on.  Things like the guys stated above, ball positioning, execution, mental awareness, etc.  You also might want to temper your expectations a bit as well.  You seem to approach the table with the expectation that you have a pretty good 3-rod shot, yet you say it will fail you when crunch time comes.  You KNOW it will fail you in crunch time.  Why? 

Try to use your next tournament as an evaluation time.  When you get into one of those situation where your shot fails you, take a timeout and try to remember what is different at that moment from all of the other times when the shot works just fine.  I don't mean the fact that it is a crucial time in the game, but physical things, are you rushing the possesion, do you get into your stance, are you gripping the handle correctly, is tha ball set up in the proper place for your shot, etc.  Then go back to what I said above, DO NOT TRY TO WIN!  just try to execute your shot.  It doesn't matter whether or not it scores. What matters is whether you executed the shot to the intended hole.  That is all you have control over, and thus, that is all you should concentrate on.  REMEMBER...if you don't put the shot on goal, there is VERY LITTLE chance it will score a goal. 

[foozkillah]

Kayko,

You're absolutely right about UAE being very strong...  They are led by and have the best player in Asia, our South Florida friend Miqdad "Mickey" Suwaidi, who used to be one of the Boston area players in the 90's at Mad Maggie's and other places.  His group included the Thomases, (Nate's parents), Nate's foos buddy growing up, Billy Pappas, whom you may have heard of, and of course "King Louie" Cartwright.  He and the boys from Dubai are absolutely familiar with Tornado and professional play, and he promotes their city's and region's play.  Playing them and the Malaysians should be extremely helpful and instructive.  He also won Pro Dubs and Singles at the last Tornado Worlds in Vegas, if I recall.

I would suggest you find the better players and watch as much as you can, all the while trying to see their philosophies in shooting and defending.  I would try to remember which ones mystify or puzzle you and ask about them, from the players themselves, and on here.  Have fun in Kuala Lumpur, and enjoy the Sate' dishes!!

[Old Meister]

One thing to add that deals specifically with your concern. Most players at this tournament are going to be tight. Sometimes it is a lot of fun to get a little goofy and hang loose, laugh at all the seriousness. Go there with the idea of having fun, play games with your opponent's head, make him wonder. We can all question ourselves to a point of performing poorly but how nice to throw that off before it even starts! Decide you're going to have a blast, don't worry be happy . You tell me, how can that be a bad thing?

[kayko2000]

You also might want to start playing differently.  By that, I mean it sounds like you are trying to WIN.  Winning is not an action, it is a result.  Winning is not something you do.  Try to play each possesion of the ball perfectly.  The things you have control over are the things you should concentrate on.  Things like the guys stated above, ball positioning, execution, mental awareness, etc.  You also might want to temper your expectations a bit as well.  You seem to approach the table with the expectation that you have a pretty good 3-rod shot, yet you say it will fail you when crunch time comes.  You KNOW it will fail you in crunch time.  Why? 

Yeah, interesting way to look at it. I've thought the same thing.  I tend to have higher expectations when playing in Taiwan, because other people expect a little more from me.  Whereas, when I've played in Vancouver and San Jose, I've been loosy goosy and ended up surprising a lot of fairly good players.  Mainly because I go in mentally as an underdog and don't give myself the pressure.

I think that's how I'm approaching the VIFA Asia tournament. Just go in, have fun.

What sometimes happens is that when I'm loose, I have success and go deeper into the tournament.  And then I start to get serious (because deep down, I'm still competitive in nature), and that's when things go wrong.  So I'll focus on controlling that.