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mental attitude

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Re: mental attitude
« Reply #225 on: April 05, 2010, 01:21:37 PM »
Recent email

Hi,
Just some words on the last things you posted and maybe one or two questions, first I'll quote the concerned part of your post :
 
"As long as the input coming in to our system does not exceed our computers ability to export entropy back in to the environment, we are happy, peaceful, having fun. But we all have a level, once again based on our programming from past life experiences, at which the input coming at us exceeds our computers ability to export entropy back in to the environment. When this happens, we begin to experience the emotion of being overwhelmed. We unconsciously switch to automatic response mode. Our focus changes from positive, what we want, to negative, what we want to avoid (to much input). As we know, this can causes all fun to cease and we begin to suffer negative emotions and actions. Genie begins searching for ways to export the excess input back in to the environment. Getting mad, yelling, taking offense and thousands of other negative actions are ways we may have learned to do this. There are also positive ways to do this. Refocusing, becoming calm etc.

I hope this is not to confusing. The threshold concept is a way of thinking that explains what happens to us when we experience dysfunctional actions and feelings. It also explains why successful people don’t!"
 
First this is not confusing at all, I can almost sense and "touch" what you are saying there, this sensation of being overwhelmed is really familiar to me : when things go "to fast" the other way round, I feel some kind of heat in my brain, that's when I'll try for example a 5 bar shot and immediately tell myself "Why the hell do you do this ?", and that's the automatic response mode.
 

When I think back of when I started foos, first tournament I entered in a small bar with like 15 players I was shaking before playing the first ball, later on when I started playing bigger tourneys with I felt so much pressure just thinking about not taking these slops, I would let one or two get in per match... Now it's still not perfect, but lately I've been able to manage important matches without feeling this sort of pressure, but you know the "good pressure", the one that makes you play well and keep the focus.

Last time I felt bad pressure was at that small tournament right before the open doubles final started, when I saw people around the table waiting to see the match. I was like "Why now ? I've already played in front of 10 times the people here..." I think I felt that because that tournament was important to me, in an emotional way you know. Anyway I had to do something to cool down, so I asked for a referee and that worked ! I don't know, his presence on the table kinda calmed me down, because if there are discussions about faults and stuff during a match it can bug me and take me out of it (it overwhelms me actually). So finally everything went fine and we won the tournament ;-)

 
I wrote this just to know if this "progression" in managing the pressure/tension has something to do with "raising my threshold" ?
 
I think yes it does and that I've raised it along the years by acquiring experience, but I'm pretty sure you have methods and/or stuff in your bag to raise it faster and/or higher right ? ;-)
 
Oh and remember that  ****** guy that used to post on bit on the thread ? He won his first open singles at the very same tournament I mentioned earlier, in a way you have something to do in that week-end's results ! ;-)

Ans: It’s very gratifying when I see that my stuff is working for someone
Joe – Pressure/ tension are some of the many negative emotions that interfere with performance, and learning to manage them is what this is about.

If the motor in your car isn’t running properly, and you leave it alone, it will not fix itself.. In fact eventually it may break down. If you do not know anything about motors, and you try to fix it yourself, you may fix it fast, or you may waste much money and time doing hit and miss repairs until you get lucky and fix it. Or you can take it to a mechanic who knows how to fix it. Spend a lot of money and time. And the next time it starts running badly, more money and time, and you still don’t know why it wasn’t working. I’m just trying to give you some knowledge that will help you fix your motor yourself. Not only fix it, but turn it into a high performance motor. Mechanics school if you will. And when you know how, you won’t have to waste all that money and time! Soon your motor will be a fine tuned machine that can run with the best of them. And you will know how to fix it yourself, fast. Then instead of wasting all that time not understanding it and trying to fix it, you can spend your time racing with the big boys.

Understanding “threshold” is learning how your motor (mind) works. It is possible to raise your threshold just through hit and miss experience (letting your mind run unconsciously), but this is a crapshoot at best and can take a long time if it happens at all. Understanding how to raise your threshold is how you turn your mind in to a fine tuned machine, and maintain it, in a much shorter time.

All these concepts, techniques and metaphors are about fine tuning your mind! Patience. You’re getting it!


You wrote that to reach our goals one way to get there is to make a small mental film of what we want and repeat it daily in our head.

In my case the movie mostly consist of simply beating Rico, you know getting that match ball on the 3, scoring it and shaking hands with a yelling crowd... What I think is crazy is whenever I imagine myself playing that final ball I instantly feel tension/pressure (not the good one, the "tetanizing" (does that word exist in english ?) pressure, my heart start beating harder, etc...

Do you think I have to go through this movie until I get used to the situation and don't feel that pressure anymore? Or do you think I should change a bit my movie, focusing only on the result I want (winning the game) and not thinking about actually having to score that ball (how to win it on the table) ?

I don't know something tells me that visualizing to much playing that ball would actually prevent me from performing well the day it will come (and it will), over thinking and preventing the "whatever be ok" going on
 
Have another tournament this week-end in Germany, I've printed your posts (that's 44 pages in Word !!!) and I'll try to give it a read during the week-end ;-)
Thanks again
Joe

Joe
The movie you have made is creating expectations regarding a specific event. It is these expectations that are creating the negative (fear of not accomplishing them) emotions. Rico is arguably the best player in the world. If you beat him the first time you meet him in a final it will be a hell of an accomplishment. But if you are expecting to, and you don’t, you have set yourself up for much disappointment and suffering (these negative emotions will cause a set back in your progress) Make the first goal to get in a final against him. If you win the first time, awesome. If you don’t, look him in the eye, shake his hand, analyze and learn, go back to work, and know in your heart that your time is coming. If your desire is strong enough, you’ll get him sooner or later! Believe it.

Try something like this for your movie:
Imagine you are sitting in the stands before a pit match. Hear the voice of Jim Stevens (twif announcer) say “before we begin the match I would like to introduce one of the top players in the game, Mr. Joe”. Feel the emotions you would have. Accomplishment, pride, satisfaction. Know that you have already beaten Rico and all the other top players. Know, experience, that you have earned these rewards. Tip your hat to the crowd, and enjoy the match.


Zeek

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #226 on: April 06, 2010, 01:50:35 PM »
More from Joe

Hi,
 
Thanks a lot for the reply, much apreciated.

 
"If you beat him the first time you meet him in a final it will be a hell of an accomplishment. But if you are expecting to, and you don’t, you have set yourself up for much disappointment and suffering (these negative emotions will cause a set back in your progress)"
 

Don't worry I'm full aware of that, I've already played him several times and I "know how good I am", in singles I know I have no chance, I've got yet to work on several areas in my singles game before pretending even a challenge on him for one set (could say one ball actually ^^) you know. I'm still battling to win an amateur singles event, top players are still too far for me, in singles I'm more working on beating the "low-level" players, as for 3 years I've lost against players that were technically not better at all than me. But now it's changing thanks to you and to the practice time I've put in ;-)
Well turning back to the movie in doubles I think we really have a chance, first 2 or 3 times we played him he owned us like no one did, but last time we took him one set and were one ball from winning a second one and taking him (and billy) to the final set ! So we can do it, but I get your warning and I'll pay attention to that.
 
Anyway back to this week-end, I did read all your writing during the travel to the tournament area and the effects were really great. What I did most for example when I was defending on the five or in the goalie area was to not pay attention to what I was doing (my defense) but to what I wanted (getting the ball), I would just fix the ball and let my body do what was needed to get that ball, and most of the time it would end up in my hands, sometimes in weird ways but it did !
Same as in offense, most of the time I made the picture in my mind of the shot getting in and letting my body do it for me it would work, sometimes it didn't but almost each time I think I've interfered with my "genie" as you call it, I've not clearly identified what I did wrong but I felt it (and therefore I can fix that), it's like I forced something in the last moment. Hardest part was to use that technique all the time, you know as the weekend goes along tireness comes in and it becomes harder and harder to focus like needed, and sometimes the automatic mode would run in to give some fresh air to the brain.  
I also lost a match right after I ate, that happens too often, you have to eat a good meal at some point, but then if you have to play you're kinda down and I've yet to find a way to manage these moments. I asked Rico about that and know what he told me ? --> "That's the match you've got to win !" ^^
 
I tried also to be the witness when things went wrong and chase the negative emotions away, worked pretty well and felt my threshold never got passed, except maybe that game against that team where I could not stand the person playing as the goalie, you know the one who yells when scoring a slope... But I didn't feel overwhelmed, it's more like I've put my focus in the wrong place you know.
 
All in all great experiences, came back with lot of stuff to work on (technically and mentally) and plus I've won another doubles (pro-am) with my brother !! :-)
 
ps: I saw you posted the mails in the forum, I think removing information to stay anonymous is just not possible (as we're only two on that forum that play in germany I think if he reads your post he'll know for sure it's me hehe), so let it be ok and stop that kiddish paranoïa ;-)
 
Jean
Great stuff!
A few more things.
 
If you are working, consciously, at witnessing it will eventually become habit. Takes time.

sending instructions to genie, and then getting out of the way and letting genie do what you have asked, trusting, is key! You are beginning to experience that.
 
I once asked Gary Pfeil why he would stand at the table for hours and hit sometimes 1000 balls in a day. Seemed like overkill to me. He said that he did not believe he really started "learning" until he began to get tired. I understand now that he was practicing focusing under pressure.
 
I have been working with David Vick on managing his routine just prior to and during a tournament. Here are a few things we are working on: (comes from my golf experience)
1) Dont start "gearing" up for a big tournament to soon. Hank Haney told me that Tiger sticks to his normal daily practice routine until 10 days prior to a tournament. Thats when Hank flies in and they start working on their game plan. I think this has something to do with burn out. This is his way of assuring that his mind is fresh and sharp for the tournament.
2) Try to stay as close to your normal daily routine as possoble during the tournament. Example: If your first match is at 1 pm, and you normally get up at 7am in the morning, it may be unwise to think "i can sleep in til 11am". Same with going to bed. If possible, got to sleep at your normal time. This has to do with maintaining your bodys accustomed routine and rythum
3) I learned this from Master Chung during my Taekwondo days. The night before the tournament try to eat a hearty sized meal consisting of pastas and vegitables. Avoid sugar. Drink a lot of water. On the day of the tournament, eat a normal breakfast at the normal time if possible. Best if you can do this at least1 to 2 hours before first match. During the competition eat a banana or apple whenever you feel hungry. Note: sometimes you do not feel hungry due to the intensity. You should be aware of this, and eat the fruits occasionally even if you do not feel like it. Eat a normal lunch if you can do so at least 1 hour before your next match. Otherwise, eat the fruits. Drink a lot of water!

P.S. - That person you "did not like" is someone that will always be there! In every tournament. Just another of many adversities to deal with. Thinking that someday he will not be there is playing white must win. let it be ok, and learn to deal with him

Zeek
« Last Edit: April 06, 2010, 02:09:08 PM by zeek mullins »

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #227 on: April 06, 2010, 04:41:31 PM »
Zeek, sorry I didn't get to meet you when you were down in Houston. Maybe next time you are here or we are both at a tour event. Something just struck me as really funny while reading some of your last post, I say some because I don't have much time right now, and that's a long post. What's funny is that I was thinking that either you are really good on the keyboard or if you are like me you spend a LONG TIME writing your posts. ;D

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #228 on: April 07, 2010, 01:43:25 PM »
Years ago, during the cold war, there was a three country track meet between USA, Russia and France. France won, USA was second and Russia was third. The headline the next day in a major Russian newspaper read "Russia finishes third, USA finishes next to last"

Its all in how you look at it

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #229 on: April 07, 2010, 01:49:12 PM »
Comeback Kid
when you think as slow as i do, you dont have to be able to type very fast. I would love to talk with you. do i know you? whats your name?

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #230 on: April 13, 2010, 12:32:53 PM »
No you don't know me , but I play in Houston at least once a month at the Birthday Bash. My name is Paul Biquet. Started playing in the early 70's, toured in the 80's and took 10 years off in the 90's. Played about 2 or 3 local tournaments a year from 2000 to 2006. In 2007 I started playing at the B-Bashes then started hitting a few tour stops in 2008. Texas State, The Bart-O, and last year I went to Worlds in Dallas. This year I plan to make it to 3 or 4 tour events. I've been helping Bill V, and Will with their games a little, but mostly working on my game. I fell into the class that got set back from Pro to Semi-Pro since I didn't play for 10 years. Between age and forgetting what I did know before I took off, it has been a slow process to get my game back to a high level. I think I am on the verge of making the break-through and winning some tour events this year. My first goal is to make Pro, then if I have enough time before I get to old, Pro Master. If not that's OK, I'm gonna have fun trying. Hope to meet you soon Zeek!

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #231 on: April 22, 2010, 06:24:51 AM »
Jesus Christ, this thread is still alive?  :o :o :P :P

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #232 on: April 22, 2010, 07:28:13 AM »
Yeah Ice, it's still alive. I PMed you on the other board about the Austin foosfest but never got a reply. Got teamed up with Bill Henderson. Look forward to seeing you again. I know you'll be at Texas State.

I have some stuff to add to this thread, but haven't had time to think about how to put it into words yet. Maybe next week after Austin I'll get time to think it out.

Paul

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #233 on: April 22, 2010, 08:44:44 AM »
Yeah, sorry about that, been a little busy as of late. Hell I still have pics to edit from the Hofc in Vegas. Still don't even know if I will be there or not, too many irons in the fire right now. Bill is a good pickup, y'all should do well, good luck.

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #234 on: April 27, 2010, 02:40:17 PM »

The deeper you get into the brackets, the more you get to experience and learn what the big boys know! Pressure is the ultimate teacher. How you deal with this pressure determines the results you get
 
Two new things to think about.

Concept of Intensity
Many people think of "pressure" as something negative. A few view it as their friend

Another definition of pressure is intensity.When you experience intensity, all your senses are razor sharp. Your body is in its "ready" mode. You are focused and ready to respond. But there are three levels of intensity. Negative intensity, nuetral intensity, and positive intensity.
 
Negative Intensity - When you are in an intense situation, and you allow your mind to go unconscious and start focusing on what you do not want, the intensity will multiply the negative responses. This just strengthens the dysfunctional responses you have learned.
 
Neutral Intensity - Here you are excited and ready to go. Like just before a match starts. You dont know what is going to happen, your just pumped and ready. You can go negative or positive from here if you dont know how to control your focus. Either way, the intensity will multiply your response. Learning to recognize negative or nuetral intensity, and use it as a trigger to create positive intensity is the key.
 
Positive Intensity -  You are focusing on what you want, and the intensity is multiplying the positive feelings. Your in the zone and having great fun.
 
If you can learn to consciously understand and recognize intensity, pressure, it can be used as a trigger to make you increase and multiply your positive focus. Or you can allow it to make you go unconscious and multiply the negative response (if you think about it, you can probably think of many times you have seen this happen). Note: Jack Nicklaus once said that the main reason he played tournament golf was for that feeling of intensity that comes with being in the hunt.
 
Second
Someone said (may have been Jack Nicklaus) that the difference between winning and second place can be the width of a peice of paper. Most PGA tournaments are usually won by one stroke. One way to look at that is that the winner had 1/4 of a swing less per day (4 rounds) than the second place player.
 
The point here is that the winners are usually the ones who pay attention to the smallest details. Diet, pre tournament routines, pre match routines, pre shot routines, stance, hand postion, stickyness of the ball you are playing, proper ball position etc. are just some of the little things that can make the difference. Remember Chunking, where you are able to move up and down in the hierarchy of thoughts, from the big picture to the smallest details. I believe that paying attention to the smallest details (something most players do not do) is where you will find that "width of a piece of paper" advantage.
 

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #235 on: April 27, 2010, 06:41:36 PM »
I learned something this weekend while playing the NW Regional. I had a good front man who was playing well and I was blocking good in back but my shots and clears were not happening and I found myself beating up on myself. My partner deserved better. We were out in 2. That was on Saturday. Sunday morning I was mulling it over knowing I was playing singles. I realized that I was beating myself up because I could see how far I was from perfect and decided to look at it from the other end and look at how much I could do as compared to not knowing anything. That is a nice place to play from because then all my skills were at hand and not forced. My first match was against a pro-master and I found myself up 4-0 by just doing the stuff I do at home, a little bit of an old school twist to today's game. Well he came back to tie it up but then I scored and won game one. Next game we went to 4-4 and he scored after I had a good shot at it, so close! The last game he got me 5-3. He was real gracious and admitted he didn't know what I was going to do next. It felt great! I then went on and won  Amateur dubs with another good front man and life is good. Perception, that is what you were talking about wasn't it Zeek? You're right on the money,,,
« Last Edit: April 27, 2010, 06:47:12 PM by Old Meister »

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #236 on: May 18, 2010, 07:36:24 PM »
I have started writing a book. Working title Peace, Happiness and Championship Foosball. To corny? probably take a while, 3-6 months hopefully.

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #237 on: May 18, 2010, 07:56:01 PM »
Too corny? My friend it will totally sell and I for one will happily buy it. Go for it!

Offline BillV

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #238 on: May 19, 2010, 12:50:26 PM »
I'd buy a copy. It would be much easier than paging through the last 16 pages of this thread.

Bill V

Re: mental attitude
« Reply #239 on: May 19, 2010, 04:11:42 PM »
It will be much more comprehinsive than this thread. Thinking about having one or two cds with it covering mechanics and strategy of the the different shots and defenses as well as how to apply my stuff to the actual playing of the game.