Topic: Basics vs Flashiness

[KlosOne]

So I've been playing for about 2, maybe about 2 1/2 years and I really enjoy playing.

However, I recently have traded practicing some of my basics, like my 5 bar, to practicing more ineffective and tricky stuff to keep myself both interested in the sport and to also try fresh new things.  For instance, my 5 bar needs work and I'll practice it for a while but after an hour or so I find myself working on my slingshot.  I want to start shooting a pull but after a few racks I drift off to working on my aerial. (And I don't have ADD, so you can rule that out.)

I think the way I figure it, as long as I'm getting some practice in on the important stuff I can also work on some more flashy might-only-use-once-in-a-while-stuff too.  I think it makes me more well rounded and gives me some more options.  I mean, a pull shot bank might come in handy one day, right?.  Also, I don't want to become too stiff of a player with no personality or become too predictable.

So my question is: Is this a good idea?  Is it a bad idea to spice up my practice sessions with a little flashiness in order to avoid becoming stagnant with the rest of my game? Or should I drill the basics into the ground until I'm a stick passing-rollover shooting machine that doesn't know how to lighten up and have fun after the tournament is over and everyone's just playing for fun? Because learning a concord pass and eclipse might be kinda cool.

[Tyler Foos]

KlosOne,

First of all, welcome to the board.

Good question and I'll bet you will get a good variety of replies here. One thing you didn't mention is how often you play against other players vs. time you spend practicing. If you have the discipline and love of the game to shoot multiple racks of pull shots on a regular basis, you are ahead of many. The best way to identify what you need to practice most is through competition, not necessarily in a tournament setting, but with someone (ideally someone better than you) that can exploit your weaknesses. If you can practice those areas your opponent exploits, your game will improve. The more people you play against, the more areas that need practice will be exposed.

Practicing trick shots can't hurt as long as you're not ignoring the bread and butter basics that will ultimately determine your competitive success. One thing I would suggest (for whatever shot you are practicing) is to also practice grabbing and controlling the ball as quickly as possible whenever you miss a shot. Games are usually won by the person that gets the most shots on goal (all else being relatively equal) with 5 bar execution and the ability to grab loose balls being the 2 main areas that can give you those extra shot opportunities. When practicing, before taking a 3 bar shot, make yourself complete a 5 to 3 pass first. Also, a lot of trick shots, when missed, can be great practice at snagging a ball that is bouncing all over the table.

Take care and good luck...................................Tyler

[Anderson]

Well, I have to say that you have the right idea. You have to have fun. When it comes to trick shots, you have to work them into a standard consistent offense. As an example of this I shoot a 3-man bank on Bonzini. The problem with that is that on some days I'm dead on and can't miss, but the defense doesn't expect anything else, and on the days when my shot is off, well now I have to change to a different offense. The key is to find a way to work your trick shots into a standard well designed set. I'm currently using a backpin offense, and working the bank in, but less than I use to. I'm now using the more consistent shot more, the push and pull, but the bank is always an option and even on the bad days, the defense still has to think about it. I just watched a match on youtube, P4P against Collignon(doubles) where the forward has a good pull shot. He set it up and came around it for a forward bank from the middle. It worked because you have to respect the hammer. But he's not going to use that shot a lot, but occassionally to get in someone's head. That's the way trick shots should be used. I'm still losing because I'm still using them too much. They're fun to practice though. The funny thing about that match, Collignon shot a trick shot right after that, basically a push kick to a sharp angle which was super fast. Earlier in that match the German team attempted an aerial but missed. Later Jamal set up the same shot and hit it. The other team opened up the trick shots and Collignon and company responded with force. The pros can hit trickshots, they just seldom ever use them, because, well, they're pros.

[KlosOne]

Thanks for both of your replies and Tyler thanks for welcoming me on the boards.

So, to answer your question, I play a lot of people that are better than me. In fact, pretty much all of my foosball friends are better, most having played for many years more and some of them being semi-pros, pros, or at least ranked amatuers with a decent amount of tournament experience.  So I try to learn some of that stuff to throw them off a bit.  Also, since I don't own a table and I practice in a bar I don't like spending money practicing shots but rather something that has a slightly smaller chance of going in.  Cos I've probably paid for someones houseboat with the amount of quarters I've pumped into these tables.

I agree with your approach Tyler; recently I gave myself 10 perfect wall passes in a row before I could line up to practice my rollover. It's helped a lot. Maybe if I keep doing what I'm doing and still drill the important stuff beforehand I'll end up with a well balanced game.  Thanks for your replies!

[JoeyDMaio]

I just watched a match on youtube, P4P against Collignon(doubles) where the forward has a good pull shot. He set it up and came around it for a forward bank from the middle. It worked because you have to respect the hammer. But he's not going to use that shot a lot, but occassionally to get in someone's head. That's the way trick shots should be used. I'm still losing because I'm still using them too much. They're fun to practice though. The funny thing about that match, Collignon shot a trick shot right after that, basically a push kick to a sharp angle which was super fast. Earlier in that match the German team attempted an aerial but missed. Later Jamal set up the same shot and hit it. The other team opened up the trick shots and Collignon and company responded with force. The pros can hit trickshots, they just seldom ever use them, because, well, they're pros.

Well actually the guy did his bank on the 3 row as a "desperate shot"... On youtube you have only one set of the match, at that point Fred already had'em disgusted, and so they started to play loosely, and so did Fred as he felt and knew he had the hands on the match and that it was already over...
Actually it's a bit sad to see a final being not played "for real" because the challengers don't believe they can do it, but it's not the first time I see that happen against Fred, worst being that french guy (coulibaly I think) at the bonzini wcs open singles final, at 4-1 instead of trying to come back he shoots directly the ball in his own goal from the five on purpose to move on to the next set ! It's funny to hear Jim wondering if that's legal in his comments ;-)

Anyway back to the first post of KlosOne, to me it's completely normal, I also have from time to time a period where I want to practice more trickshots, just do it !
Of course you'll never use them in competition in a close match but the "fun stuff" is nice to have in your bag because when you'll play fun pick-up games in tournaments with pros they'll notice if you can impress them a bit, and next time they may even want to play with you, and pick-up games with or against top players is a really good way to improve.
And you need those to play with non-foosers who will think the game's boring when you'll play the "effective" game in front of them, and the sport always needs new blood ;-)

[Anderson]

And you need those to play with non-foosers who will think the game's boring when you'll play the "effective" game in front of them, and the sport always needs new blood ;-)

Great point. I think many players are drawn to this game after seeing the neat "fun" things that can be done and the skill involved. Once it's in their blood, they then start practicing to win, tailoring their game to what works most consistently, but it's the different flavors underneath, the many trick shots that drew them in to begin with, which add so much depth to the game, especially when we're playing pick-up games for fun, even among the pros.

I will tell you though that I have used trick shots to win at the tournament level, but I'm winning a whole lot more now that I've toned it down. I'm probably keeping it standard 3 out of 5 shots and the rest I'm going to the bank, and hitting it. The key is that my set up, the back pin, allows for both from the same position. I'll probably tone it down soon to 4 out of 5 standard once my backpin gets better and I learn to master the angles, and someday the trick shot might disappear completely once I've really mastered the backpin.

[Tyler Foos]

Joey,

Actually it was Franck Mahy at the 2007 Bonzini Worlds open singles final. At 4-1 Colignon, Mahy's serve, he sets the ball down on his 5 row and flips the rod over backwards, scoring the final point of game one on himself, intentionally. The part Jim Stevens was questioning about being legal had to do with Mahy not going through the correct serve protocal - 'ready? 'ready.' then procede. Mahy just hit it in almost as soon as he set the ball on the playfield. Regardless, he gave Fred more momentum on top of what he already had - didn't work well for Mahy!

A thought to add about trick shots is regardless of their overall efficiency, practicing them does add to a player's ball control skills and could prepare you for someone else trying them on you. The more diversity you have skill wise, the better prepared you become in total.

Tyler