Topic: The Rules of Foosball by Adrian Zamora Sponsored by Fireball

[BradLaurine]

The Rules of Foosball by Adrian Zamora, one of the head officials for International Table Soccer Federation.

http://www.fireballtablesoccer.com/joomla15/itsf-rules-on-video.html

Please excuse this video being filmed in 2007-08 on a different table other than a Fireball but all the rules are ITSF rules of play as of 2011.

The first 2 segmented video's are of the basic rules. Most of tour players completely understand these rules. Here is the surprising part. Chapters 2-7  you will go, "oh, I get it, now" or "yea, that is right" but mostly you will say "I know that".

Chapter 2 - 9 are for more competitive play. Again, these rules are up to date as of 2011.

The page is slow to load. The chapters are broke out but I felt it important to give the viewer the chance to pick and choose more than trying to find a section.

Adrian and I hope that you will learn a little about the Rules of Foosball sponsored by Fireball

[foozkillah]

Brad,
Are Adrian and others on the Tornado/IFP tour, effective this week, working on a new set of IFP/Tornado International/Global Rules for play on Tornado Tables?  This is really needed soon (now) since there will be no ITSF-Sanctioning or ITSF-recognition of the competing Tornado/IFP World tour. (nor will there prolly be.. ever)..
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I'm sure some basic rules that depend on the physical differences of North American 3goal figure / rectangular playing field tables will DIVERGE, logically, while there will prolly be more and more pressure to disallow these type of tables altogether on ITSF events.  Rulings like limits on moving a ball stuck at or near the wall typically make no sense on ITSF tables, but certainly need at least paragraphs for Tornado/IFP World rules.. T/I World rules could prolly change away from the "corners" rule for any ball off the table, back to the original rules, and they could certainly add "foosing" the ball from a center hole back...
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If the P4P group has their own rules to match their recognized and sanctioned tables, taking only what they wish that match from ITSF rules and rankings, WHY WOULDN'T TORNADO/IFP dump anything they want from ITSF rules, sanctions and specifications... ? Like the point and rankings system?  Of course your Fireballs in US North American configuration could also use either set of rules (or both) as they evolve ... ITSF vs Tornado/IFP World rules..
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No Tornado promoter/purveyor/distributor is under any direction ANY MORE, AT ALL, to follow ITSF rules as long as T/I World agrees with it...  All that ITSF paperwork can go to the shredder or the fireplace ASAP.   What is market penetration for Tornado after 4 decades in North America, 85-90 %?  None of the indies can be afraid of losing ITSF recognition, let alone ITSF certification ever again... since it NO LONGER EXISTS for their thousand and thousands of Tornado's in play and in use.
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So when are the North American rectangular field / 3player goal Rules coming out?  They've been due since last week.
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Plus they need a retrograde kit with paint and decal removal for Tornado's, so anyone wishing to be current can de-cert or de-ITSF their nice tables...  Perhaps Charlie Mac or Jim Waterman on here can come out with these soon...

[BradLaurine]

Foozkill...er,
Read this with a smile...
No, they are not working on this refinement of the rules this week, but I will bet they will, in the near future, with your help...
Nice soap box you have there fella, can I borrow it?

I hear exactly what you are saying. I understand exactly what you are saying. I agree with your thoughts.

Do you think knowing most of the rules in the Basic Rules of Foosball, will be good for future players?

Lets get people to understand and SEE that these are the rules for basic play all over the world. Foosball.com is truly a Worldwide website and this forum is viewed by thousands of players, new and old every month. ITSF rules are 97% American rules. Your point is on 3%, BTW that is not my calculations, that was several others who did the number crunching.

Try this again.

The Rules of Foosball by Adrian Zamora, will examine the basic rules for Foosball. These rules will help beginners and experts to understanding the game better.

[foozkillah]

Brad,
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I'm sure those ITSF rules will help anyone going through the basics of foosball, as well as highlight the fact that there are, and have been for a long time, knowledgeable referees in a structured system for foosball.  And they're obviously valid for all Fireball tables since it did come in as the sanctioned and recognized 5th ITSF tournament table. Congrats again by the way.... and I've known about the quality behind Fireball a full year before all these new converts started harping about it... Shanghai Fred, Dennis' bud, and my friend from his stay in South Florida, sent me the info and pics on Fireball 2 yrs ago,when it became China's table of choice.  Now that your coin-ops are out, they should provide a wonderful alternative for venues for local DYP's and BYP's... perhaps the only choice for locations neglected or forgotten by Tornado.  I'm intrigued by what would transpire if and when Fireball starts appearing on the eastern seaboard states, where the ball control issues could never again be used by players of the French game as an excuse, and Tornado style fellow Americans would have none, either.
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Since a large potential customer base for Fireball USA would include North American foosers who come from a 30-40 yr Tornado tradition (by default, of course, and their original durability and staying power...) I was wondering what Fireball USA would sanction for its rules on this continent.. If Tornado/IFP  (3% you say huh... and yes I believe ya) comes out with new non-ITSF rules like foosing the ball, changing to their version of the "Colorado Clear" rules, remove the "Win by Two" for the final game in a match, or perhaps even change the time limits for the goal area, and even re-allow aerial shots and clears... how local US promoters for Fireball USA would react to this.  Those Fireball TD's will always have final say, of course... for their events.... but since a big part of their entries will have been playing under the new T/IFP World Tour rules, you can be PRETTY DARN SURE THAT T/IFP WILL NOT BE DOING YOU OR FIREBALL ANY FAVORS BY MAKING THE TRANSITION TO YOUR EVENTS ANY EASIER, AS IN USING ROUGHLY EQUIVALENT RULES ... (which would also be a sign that they recognize you as a legit up and coming competitor in the Coin-op and parts arena which they ,,, uhhh ,,, kinda really value, so it should also be a good sign)
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And hey.... if you believe it's yours and Fireball's time, then by all means... step up on this soapbox with me... go git 'im!

[BradLaurine]

Great Post

Thank you Foozkillah!

I am an advocate of the current rules and most of the changes. Adrian, Tom and Mark from Germany, plus others worked hard at getting things settled to conform to most tables.
The other board is talking about the drop and rule, plus other details, like what you are writing about.

Fireball tables do not have the same problems like the Tornado table, when comes to the walls. Fireball incline is vastly superior, compared to Tornado strips and will not get "stuck". 2 walls stays.

I choose to forget the hole in the side wall for two reasons. 1. beginners can't drop to themselves, so let the learning curve start on the field of play, not because you know how to serve through the hole. 2. manufacturing without the hole is easier.  Less chance of mistakes in a multiple ways.
Ariel is cool with me, but how many can do it?
Off the table, stays exactly the same as it is written. Dead ball same thing. Great for everyone to understand where it goes all around the world.
Fireball and ITSF is in America. When Tornado does an international event, which rules are used? To me it is ridicules to have rules for this country or that. I am willing to have a protocol that works around the world but in my backyard, sort of speaking, tap the side and put it the middle. We are all smart enough to know when someone is ready or not.

Thanks for the great thread.

Brad Laurine

[gitablok]

Just for the record, the aerial and other shots like it, like the eclipse , were not outlawed by ITSF. We outlawed it. Local player Jack Wentworth was the absolute best at it, his arsenal included passes to the three rod in doubles, he was simply sick at it, and yes, better than Billy at it. What you must realize is at first world cup in Hamburg, the American rulebook was the one adopted into use. There have only been minor changes most insignificant. The biggest is prolly ball off the table. This rule worked fine in Europe until Amercan head official  Tom
Yore decided to REinterpret the rule, now it's a mess. Others like dead ball behind the five, all infractions go to the five, are good changes and should be kept. The other big but insignificant change is the drop. I have still yet to hear anyone say things might have been different in that match if I was allowed to drop the ball.

So those ITSF rules are actually your American rules hard at work with an international stamp on them. 

[foozkillah]

No contention here, Ice!
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But the important thing is that Tornado/IFP could very well have a different set of "New American Rules," just to be different.
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As you pointed out... adding the drop back wouldn't change much, although I do like the P4P's sanctioning of aerial shots and passes, because aerials are part of original field soccer to begin with.  Off the table possession rules and infractions going to nearest bar involved, not the five, wouldn't be much of a hassle, either...  But it definitely would be different... and if T/IFP wants to differentiate themselves much the way P4P does, then they very well could do this.
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Not being ITSF sanctioned or recognized also goes both ways... Wouldn't be too outlandish to reason that having "As outlined in ITSF Rules such-and-such" in the new Tornado/IFP rulebook would not be in good form. Any mention of cross-linking or any relationship with, or even mention of, the ITSF would not be "nice" in the new, independent Tornado, seeking to reestablish it's own World tour.

[gitablok]

Like I said before, good luck with the aerial , it was outlawed by us before the ITSF showed up. And I don't know if I can justify the manpower or monetary expense to eliminate 4 letters from rule book right now. Just make the adjustments needed and roll with it.

Tornado is free of the ITSF.... No need to spend money to prove it.

[foozkillah]

Like I said before, good luck with the aerial , it was outlawed by us before the ITSF showed up. And I don't know if I can justify the manpower or monetary expense to eliminate 4 letters from rule book right now. Just make the adjustments needed and roll with it.

Tornado is free of the ITSF.... No need to spend money to prove it.

Yeah, I guess so... but if they eventually decide on whatever tweaks they wish to have... Which they'll have to anyway, since I doubt Tornado will be sending out any old rulebooks with new non ITSF tables... like a P4P-similar edition with aerials and foosing and whatever... it should take... uhhh... 4 maybe 6 manhours to edit the rules (they're all electronically stored now.. I hope), put it up as an additional free download or maybe $5.99 or something to order a booklet .. on Mary's and Tornado's sites..  good promotion, good gimmick to get people on the website, and great idea to announce the new tour and the new conditions..
I agree there'd be time and manpower on deciding the tweaks.. but if it is just tweaks ala P4P... shouldn't be too tough..