Topic: Tornado TP 2000 Upgrades

[Martin7]

Hi guys,

I might have the chance to buy an used TP 2000 for home use (and maybe training) - I know that there were some changes on the T3000 compared to the TP 2000. Iīm aware (please correct me if Iīm wrong) like other bearings and leighter rods including improvements of the foosball man toe.

Was there anything else which have any influences on the gameplay?
My main question now is, is it possible to upgrade the TP2000 to a "T3000" to have basically the same gameplay as on a T3000?

Thanks in advance
Martin

[SilverSurfer1]

Hi Martin,

The short and simple answer is: Yes, you can upgrade a TP 2000 and get it to play very similarly to a T3000.  As long as the rods are straight & smooth and the play field is level and in good shape.  The kit is sold on this web site.  You can find it here: http://shop.foosball.com/toupkit.html.  I purchased a Brown Marble with a chipped goal edge about 6 months ago.  After repairing the goal mouth, re-laminating the back wall and installing the upgrade kit, I cant tell the difference between it and the T3000 that we play on in our bar tournaments.  BTW the rod change was to "heat treated" commercial rods with a satin finish instead of the old chrome plated ones.  I don't think the new ones are any lighter.  If your original rods are in good shape, there is no need to double your expense by replacing them.  Happy foosing!!!

[Martin7]

Hi SilverSurfer,

Thanks for the reply. This specific table is from 1996, so its pretty "old" - costs would be around 800$. But itīs the first used table which I found so far - used Platinum Edition Tables are sold for around 1200-1300 $ but there isnīt any available at the moment. So maybe itīs worth to wait for such a table to get already the latest version (which isnīt indeed so much important since itīs only for home use but it would be almost the same price when upgrading the T2000).

There arenīt any differences in quality or? Meaning that the T2000 is better than T3000 or vice versa.

[kgstewar]

Is the table that you are looking at the mahogany laminate TP2000 with split cabinet? Or the brown marble without split cabinet?

http://www.foosballsoccer.com/time-play-2000.html

If it was built in 1996, I assume the latter. The mahogany TP2000 is basically a coin-op without the coin mechanism and would be worth upgrading, although I wouldn't spend more than ~$400 on the original table before upgrades. I *think* the brown marble TP2000 does not have the split cabinet and it may be lighter than the equivalent coin-op of that vintage (I could be wrong here). If it were me, I wouldn't feel good about putting $800 into that table, better to wait for a true coin-op or coin-op-quality table.

[Martin7]

Hey kgstewar,

Itīs the marble Version but coin-op and seems to have also a split cabinet after looking at the Pictures but I can double-check with the seller.

Here are some pics of the table:




After reading some stuff on the internet, I found also some informationīs that the quality of the tables decreased over the years at Valley? Meaning that the Players break too fast, rods are not the best anymore - is that nonsense or true?

Source:
http://www.netfoos.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=3127

[SilverSurfer1]

Hi Martin,

  The table you are looking at is a Brown Marble coin op.  I would consider $800 to be twice as much as I would want to pay for the table you are looking at.  However, it does appear to be in pretty good shape.  If the play field is level and the rods are not bent, it would be a great table with the upgrade kit installed.  But, not if the initial price was anything over $500.     
  I picked up mine for $200 only because it had a chipped goal mouth.  The guy who sold it to me had it listed on CL for $500.  I purchased and installed the upgrade kit for $230.  I can also tell you that all of the upgrade items that I received seem to be very high quality and I am extremely happy with the results.  The table plays absolutely great!!   

[clint1080]

relevant info:
http://foosball.com/forum/index.php?topic=2704.0

[johnwallan]

Oh, the joy and expense of Upgrading... I don't play at a high level but I have noticed my old brown marble and modern t3000 are very similar in feel.  In between is a wide variety of tables that look the same but have issues with softer mdf goal posts, uneven playfield, and have a less predictable feel when handling the ball.  If you have found a brown marble in good condition it is likely solid like a tank.  Keep in mind the costs of any upgrades to make it like a t3000, because it adds up fast.  There is a wide variety of age issues with old brown marble tables, but if the ball contacted areas and bearing holes are in good shape... well it is probably a good deal.  My brown marble has 40000+ games on its counter from being in a bar... still perfect playfield areas, posts laminate is not chipped, recently I upgraded it all including 2 bar and forward 3 bar.  Likely a bad decision all at once $$$... but it plays awesome now.

[Martin7]

Thanks for all the informationīs - Iīll wait to see if there will be any/which other used tables available and wont buy the Brown marble due to the age and price - after reading the thread from the link which Client provided a Grey marble 30th 30th Anniversary sounds best to me or a real T3000.

[Martin7]

Ok, next used available table is a Cyclone 2 coin-op from a Pro-Player. Going to have a look at the table tomorrow. Costs are about 700$, but in general the costs here in Austria will be usual higher than in US anyway.

What you think? Is it a good table and worth it to buy if the price is good? Does this one have any specific issues with the playfield or anything?

[bolt115]

Well the Cyclone 2 is not a coin-op    http://www.vdlp.net/tornado/cyclone2.asp     that is on valley/dynamo website   so  keep that in mind.  Some had issues with flaking chrome on rods.  The men, rods, and bearings should match what was used on t2000 coin-op of similar year.  The price is probably ball park for overall market that  includes less hardcore players then you will encounter on this site.  In general most on here(who do not think much of home models)  would advise waiting for a coin-op table as it is a more solid table made for commercial setting.  That being said I did own one for awhile and never had any quality issues and it played fine, upgraded  to a coin-op when one became available at reasonable price/distance and was able to sell Cyclone 2 (excellent shape)  for what i had into it -  $550 and it sold quickly.

[Martin7]

Weird, maybe the coin-mechanism have been added after purchase or itīs a "Special Edition"? But I agree, a coin-up is also a basic requirement for me but itīs not as easy as in the US to get such a nice Table (might be the almost the same Situation for you guys in the US to get a Bonzini ). I can provide tomorrow more informationīs about the table after I had a look on it.

At the Moment I just have the Infos of the seller so it could be also a Tornado Blonde which seems to be a bad idea to purchase when I read the Infos about this table...

[Martin7]

Ok, as exptected it isnīt a Cyclone II.

Split-cabinet
Coin-up

Looks like this one (just googled for a similiar Picture):


Tornado Blonde? Serial was #2620

[SilverSurfer1]

  You are correct.  That is a Tornado Blonde.  If you go to see it, look carefully at the condition of the play field.  Is it worn in areas?  Is it level?  Also, check out the sides of the goals.  Is there any chipping in the laminate or substrate MDF?  Be sure to bounce one of the balls off of all areas of the walls.  Do they sound solid?  Does the ball rebound uniformly off the walls in every area of the table?   Those things would be the potential deal breakers.  The condition of the rods is your next concern.  Pull each rod all the way out.  Then give them a spin and look for any wobble.  A minor amount will will have minimal effect on the playability of the table.  If any need to be replaced, the price is around $35 per, plus shipping.  Finally, check out each of the men and handles for chipping and hairline cracks.  Those will cost around $5 per, plus shipping.
  In conclusion, the Blonde is a great table.  Some have posted in this forum that it is their "least favorite Tornado coin op".  I wouldn't let this scare you away from this table.  It is still a Tornado coin op which makes it a very high end foosball table that will probably outlast it's owner.  The Carrera is my least favorite Porsche.  But, I would still prefer it over almost any other make or model of car.  See my point?         

[Martin7]

Hey guys,

I ended up not buying the Tornado Blonde - the condition of the table was not the best, so Iīve decided to wait. Maybe got the chance now to buy a 2 year old T3000 which would be pretty good but Iīm just uncertain about all the quality issues which Iīve read about the new tables (thread by BBtuna - issues with warped surfaces, rods bending, man too close to the Surface)

http://foosball.com/forum/index.php?topic=2331.0

Since this thread is from 2010, Iīm not sure if those issues has been fixed since 2013?


Whatīs your thoughts on this? Donīt mind it and get it if the condition/Price is good or wait for an older model?